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April 20, 2021, 05:16:50 PM

A simple question...

This is a discussion for the topic A simple question... on the board Beach Buggy Electrical Help.

Author Topic: A simple question...  (Read 528 times)

this user is offline Manxdavid

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on: March 02, 2021, 10:13:04 AM
 Okay I've been into buggies for a long time and see them as an antidote to the sickness that modern cars often are, over complicated and unable to be worked on my a layman. I see my buggy to be closer in alignment to something like an MG TC than to a Ferrari. So what is it with relays? Fuses too?

I see people on here and online doing wonderfully neat wiring jobs on buggies but seemingly incorporating banks and banks of relays and multiple fuse boxes. When VW built the car that my buggy is based on they didn't fit one relay unless you include the flasher unit and only six fuses. They just used decent wire, decent quality switches and a foot dip switch. I followed their lead and everything on my car has always worked fine, no electrical gremlins in 20+ years.

Are all these relays to allow thinner wires and crappier switches to be used or are folks just showing off? And the fuses? My old Morris Minor only had two (three if you include the one they hid behind the speedo....grrrr....) What gives? I just don't get why people over complicate a simple vehicle.

Confused of Anglesey :-\



« Last Edit: March 02, 2021, 10:16:11 AM by Manxdavid »
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this user is online Dave DND

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Reply #1 on: March 02, 2021, 11:02:57 AM
They just used decent wire, decent quality switches and  . . . . .

I think you may have answered your own question there  ;)

Its also a case of "good practice" too with many following the more modern guidelines when building. Sure, you may not need a relay for a headlight like you did in the olden days, but then the contacts inside the modern switches are built with a lifespan in mind rather than the brass contacts in the older stuff.

So how do you turn on your own headlights? Have you progressed to safety matches yet, or still using wood and hot embers?   :P
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this user is offline snoopy

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Reply #2 on: March 02, 2021, 11:26:38 AM
Wait until you see folks putting can bus systems in buggies with computers for the seat and light controls, auto sensing wipers and stuff.

Simple is nice, reliable and nearly trouble free whilst easy to diagnose a problem.


this user is online Dave DND

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Reply #3 on: March 02, 2021, 12:28:11 PM
Canbus?  ;D

Roadrunner has gone way beyond that and his ignition is controlled via the Bluetooth app on his phone !!    :-)Geek


I just don't get why people over complicate a simple vehicle.

I do agree with you  ;-)up

There is a lot to be said for keeping it simple, and if you can find good quality genuine and serviceable parts, then you can certainly end up with a very reliable vehicle as a result

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this user is offline Manxdavid

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Reply #4 on: March 02, 2021, 12:47:48 PM
My trusted brands apart from VW are Durite (I've used their stuff all my working life) and Lucas if you can get it. Bosch for ignition parts, NGK or Champion for plugs and that's about it.

Less is more in my world ;-)up
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"Ah, Beach Buggies, sure, just a quick cheap way of getting a few more years out of a rusty Beetle. You can throw one together in a weekend." anon.


this user is offline Paul1953

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Reply #5 on: March 02, 2021, 01:01:10 PM
I think you may have answered your own question there  ;)    Yep    ;-)up ;-)up

Seems a long time ago now when Manx Dave responded to a post of mine regarding hot start relays. When he noted that VW made mention of ex aircooled vehicle relay being utilised way back in the mists of time I obtained several differing NOS relays, (SWF, Hella etc), and took the covers off for a look see.  No comparison internally quality wise compared to modern off the shelf stuff.  Would I put 40 amps through the SWF & Hella... absolutely. Would I put 40amps through a modern so called "mini relay" with it`s 40amp rating.... Not for anything !!!!   ;D

Why do some of us go a tad further down the wiring route ???  Well  I absolutely love it and yes the multitude of soldering iron scars on my body attest to a "baptism in hot solder".  Long may it continue  ;D ;D


this user is offline Doon L001

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Reply #6 on: March 02, 2021, 01:32:52 PM
Guilty as charged

But

My extra relays and fuses are running things like airhorns, controls for a heated jacket etc that weren't on the 1972 nettle. And as Paul says I enjoyed doing it.
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this user is offline Roadrunner

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Reply #7 on: March 02, 2021, 02:01:23 PM
For the relays, good practice is to split left and right for both side and main beams.  Thats 4 straight away, and really a safety must so that you don't lose all your lights with the blow of 1 fuse.

The multiple fuse boxes are mainly because the ones easily available today only have a single imputes for multiple outputs.  So if you are wiring permanent live circuits and 2 auxiliaries (1 with is off during cranking), then you are looking at 3 boxes.

Yes it's not as simple, but there are good reasons for it.


this user is offline snoopy

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Reply #8 on: March 02, 2021, 04:10:03 PM
always fit 2 X 6 blade fuse boxes so lights are left side/tail right s/t and one for each headlamp beam as I have seen buggies with 1 fuse doing all the lights so one failure equals nothing at all.


this user is offline Roadrunner

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Reply #9 on: March 02, 2021, 05:03:54 PM
Exactly that Snoopy.

I remember going for a job a long time ago for a company which was having to go through the wiring loom of a Jag which have headlight wash/wipers.  It appears in Canada a driver died after using his washers in seriously subzero temperatures. The wipers had frozen solid, blew the fuse, which also happened to be for the headlights too, and the driver crashed.

Horrifies me when I see people using the EMPI loom which only has 1 light fuse.


this user is offline Manxdavid

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Reply #10 on: March 02, 2021, 05:37:03 PM
Exactly that Snoopy.

I remember going for a job a long time ago for a company which was having to go through the wiring loom of a Jag which have headlight wash/wipers.  It appears in Canada a driver died after using his washers in seriously subzero temperatures. The wipers had frozen solid, blew the fuse, which also happened to be for the headlights too, and the driver crashed.

Horrifies me when I see people using the EMPI loom which only has 1 light fuse.

Reminds me of a friend's Audi kept going into limp mode, after many trips to the dealer turns out it was a slight bad earth causing a very occasional delay on the screen wash...the poor car really thought it was it that much danger...bonkers! :-\
Photos printed on genuine ILFORDŽ paper, sent from a Commodore VIC 20.

"Ah, Beach Buggies, sure, just a quick cheap way of getting a few more years out of a rusty Beetle. You can throw one together in a weekend." anon.


this user is offline Paul1953

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Reply #11 on: March 07, 2021, 09:31:38 AM
My extra relays and fuses are running things like airhorns, controls for a heated jacket etc that weren't on the 1972 nettle. And as Paul says I enjoyed doing it.

Airhorns.....  this is the one single thing that, when as a young guy running my first buggy, changed my outlook completely...

Fitted air horns with a feed from battery to a bakelite momentary switch from a ford pop`. Was fused.  Driving home from work one evening and saw people waving and pointing like the billy ho and I thought they were just been friendly. I  looked behind me and there were smoke &  flames at the battery area. I was lucky here big time so relays for me always. (German Junkies etc still have NOS hella swf available).